« Redden's Return to Ottawa is No Big Deal | Main | Fans Getting Antsy After Two Bad Losses »

November 23, 2008


glad ricky hatton won the fight tonight :)

Also congrats to Hugh Jackman!!!!!!!!

Reposted from previous thread...because I think it jibes with what Dubi's saying...

I wrote (as Chris) on the previous thread about the lack of movement on the power play and at even strength and about the predictability of the way the team enters the offensive zone on the pp, but there's another point that needs to be made and it may be the most important point of all...

There's no passion on this team, no real willingness to make life difficult for the opponent.

Watch the way Ryan Callahn plays. The kid never passes up an opportunity to make a hit, never takes a shift off. He never turns away from a hit, never stops skating because the puck has moved away. He's not the biggest guy in the word, but he always, without fail, makes the opponent go through him to make a play.

Sometimes we see this from the fourth line...sometimes we see it throughout the lineup when they're down two in the third period, but otherwise, it's completely absent.

I think Renney is partly to blame. I understand, we're sitting at 14 - 8 (or whatever the record is) and it's not time to sound the alarm, but the all business, all the time attitude has created a brand of hockey that is too safe and too emotionless to succeed against teams that are willing to fight...and I'm not talking about literally fighting or hitting teams so hard that you hurt 'em...I'm talking about playing with an edge, playing with passion and energy, doing what Reg Dunlop preached: letting the other team know you're there. If I had a nickle for every hit passed up by this team, I'd have, like, $25. They've reduced the game to a checklist of tactical responsibilities - get the puck deep, five in the picture, shots from the point, etc. that they seem to have lost sight of the larger objective...COMPETE.

And, yes, I think Renney's partly to blame. I also think you can draw a dotted line to Avery's departure, whose mere presence forced the team to play on their toes and with an edge.

Hire Brian Burke
Fire Sather.
Move Renney to Player Development.
Hire the best coach Burke can find.
Fire PP Coach Pearn.
Hire the best PP coach Burke can find.
(Money is no object as it doesn't count against the cap)

If the team doesn't start playing with some heart, start moving the deadwood at the trade deadline or off season.

I don't care about the 30 points, I'm more worried about the performance in the last 10 games... At this point, I wouldn't trust this team to win a coin toss with three guesses.

As much as I like Tom Renney the person, Tom Renney the Ranger coach has reached the end of his time in my book.

If the team had these uninspired efforts once in a while then I would not be saying this BUT

When the message from the coaching staff is not being followed by the players then the coaching staff is losing the team.

When you are seeing multiple team meetings as the Rangers have had as of late that too is a sign of a team in trouble.

It does not matter what the team record is, the team is not following the game plan of the coaching staff which is a sign of a coach losing grip on his team.

It does not matter that the players like Tom Renney and it does not matter that Tom Renney is loyal to his players.

The Rangers need someone to insert a foot in their rear end and NO I do not think Tortella is the answer.

The answer already works for the Rangers and his name is Jim Schoenfeld.

Perhaps a shakeup is in order in the near future (whether it's a hartford call-up or a trade). Missed today's games but weren't Voros and Orr supposed to be our enforcers that prevent the opposing team to push us around and get in our heads?

Lack of finishers is still the huge achilles heel of this team. I know 14-8 is a good start but look at the Eastern Conference, teams like Boston and Montreal and Pittsburgh are incredibly deep at the forward position and they have excellent goaltending to boot. Still early in the season, but how many people here see the Rangers outlasting these teams in the playoffs with this current roster?

Angry couldn't be more right with Callahan, he's been one of my favorite players to watch on the Rangers this season. Perhaps when Gomez returns he'll give a much needed jolt to this team.

As much as I want to blame Renney I think Sather should be taking the majority of the blame as his track record over the last two seasons point to some really bad decisions (re-signing roszival, backman trade, redden 6 year deal, rissmiller 3 year deal, even gomez's deal is looking like a burden already, plus don't forget puzzling Cullen and Ward deals of 3 summers ago). Only the Zherdev deal stands out as a good move, and who knows he'll probably re-sign him in the offseason by overpaying him for something like $5.5 million per. Obviously real frustrated right now

Great minds think alike.
So do we...

I've said it from the beginning...WE SHOULD HAVE RE-SIGNED AVERY...he was arguably our most important player over the past year and a half...i'm sorry, huge mistake...the guy did it all, he played the power play, would spark the team, he even killed penalties...even if you hated him, you couldn't argue the team won with him...this team right now has ZERO heart...we have a bunch of so-called "finishers" who have nobody to get them the puck...i would have much rather given avery the 3.75 million that he would have taken to stay in NY in his PRIME than given an aging player like naslund 4 million for probably the same amount of point production at this point...we need something to wake this team, hopefully itll be gomez but who knows at this point

Adam, you are right. But that ship has sailed, and Sather is the reason for his departure. He screwed that up all the way back when he forced Avery to arbitration.

Sather has had this team for 8 years. No Cup. Not even close. Time to move on. Burke is probably the best GM available.

Time for a change.

yeah, it is too late...I just don't know what to think about this team right now

For the past three seasons, we've been a good team but we've relied on two players, Jagr and Lundqvist...Our puck possession and trap style worked because we had the personel to support that type system

Right now, we have a bunch of undersized fowards that can't handle the puck...a trap can't really be effective if the other team is handling the puck for the majority of the game...we either need to re-sign jagr and nylander or change our style of play.

Our style of play really starts on the blueline. What we have right now really doesn't cut it. When we brought in Redden, I thought we were bringing somebody in who could lead the rush and quarterback the power play. I don't know if I've been spoiled by watching Leetch all these years but that's not what i've been seeing from him. On the power player, he looks similar to our other point men. They just pass the puck on the perimeter, afraid to shoot or cut into the slot. I much rather have signed Brian Campell, a player similar to the style of Leetch than signed Redden and Kalinin for the same price. I woulda taken say Campbell and Pock then Redden and Kalinin anyday. And yeah I understand that the wait on Jagr had something to do with this. Redden has just been such a disappointment.

Unless something major happens, I just don't see this team going far. Hopefully Lundqvist can put this team on his back and bring them into the playoffs, but as we have seen, you need to be able to score in the playoffs. (And there aren't any shootouts in the playoffs!!!)

And personally, today, I thought that starting Valiquette was an ABOSULTE HORRIBLE IDEA, AWFUL...i understand lundqvist needs a break hear and there but the team KNEW how bad they played in front of henrik last game and they would have clearly put a better effort out there if HE was out there...Instead, renney decides to go with Valiquette and the team can pretend like the last game never happened, i just didn't agree with that from the sart


It is not a choice that I like but it is the reality of the Ranger's current situation.

For 3 years we have watched the Rangers not play 60 minute games as the norm. Cup contending teams give you 60 minutes of effort, pretenders try to make excuses.

My final straw was not the loss to the Canucks but not holding practice the next day. Day offs should be rewards and I would have canceled the day off.


I would have started Vally today because I don't think at this time of the season the Rangers should be playing Henrik in 14-15 straight games.

I don't have a problem starting Vally as he was not the problem, those in front of him were.

I also don't think Avery would have been a difference this season as the problems started when Sather used the money on Redden and Rozsival instead of Hainsey who has more points than both of them playing on a suspect Thrasher team.

The Rangers did not remember the lesson of it is not how much you spend but how you spend it.

so far today i have read very valid points from everyone. So far today we are hearing from fans who know their is a reason to be very concerned and are not blinded by the rangers early season record.(right on angry chris). the fact is the rangers have been playing ugly hockey especially over the last 3 weeks. they ,in fact have not taken it to any team this season. they have scored 5 goals in a game 2 times and are now 4-5-1 in the month of november. the passion is not there. besides Henrik, Ryan Callahan has been the ONLY player to show up every night. everyone else looks lost. the only other players who have been just okay are staal, mara. even drury who i like is behind the play alot and has been lacking on faceoff wins which is suppose to be one of his strong points. And what happened to dubinsky? He showed so much promise not only last season but was really good early on. Were we being fooled? because he surely looks lost now. In my opinion, and i know it wont happen is the coach needs to be replaced if not the gm too. I liked renney for bringing structure to this team that hadn't made the playoffs for all those years. I believe he has them in great shape. BUT, I also question sometimes whether he has a pulse behind the bench, which i believe reflects to the whether his team has a pulse on the ice. I said it yesterday, i believe this team has flatlined under this coaching staff and needs s shot of hockey adrenaline that I feel renney dosen't supply. He holds the wrong people accountable while giving others (mostly rosival and dawes) a pass. Crap even Kennan benched Leetch during the playoffs. would Renney ever do that? No because he would be too afraid of hurt Rosivals feelings. Plus every team needs a guy like avery was. Ottawa has rutuu. the 94 team had Esa Tikkanen. other teams have their players. Who do the rangers have now that can distract and disrupt the other team? Sather should know this because he was one of thise kinds of players. shame on him for not understanding that and for not addressing. A gm has to fill all needs in the off season to make a team whole. He has not. The best deal he has made since he has been here is getting Jagr here for half price.

Fire Perry Pearn? Are people truly that clueless? How about getting Mr. Pearn some talent? How is he responsible for bad ice and worse decisions?

All of these young guys that THIS site were perpetuating as great players are 3rd liners at best. Callahan is scrappy and has a nose for the net, that's great, but he also plays the game out of control, just like Dubinsky. That's why the puck always looks like it bounces of their sticks. THEY AREN'T VERY GOOD. They run around the ice, make a few things happen and are generally fairly likable players but the bottom line is they lack the quality. It's no revelation, that's why they, along with Dawes, were drafted with all the other players lacking real quality.

As for the defense, Rozy's confidence is shattered, thanks to the moron MSG fans. Redden is playing like he did the past 2 years, the next 5 should be crackers, And the clock has struck 12 and Girardi has turned into a pumpkin.

Seriously, take a look at the roster, this team has played above it's head to this point, and the credit for that obviously goes to Hank, but also to the coaching staff.

It has to the most boring team in the league, routinely putting me to sleep by 9'oclock on Mondays and Wednesdays.. Atleast I can be a little thankful for that.

Make a trade Glen, something drastic.. If Weight and Amonte could be traded, then I see no problem dealing Girardi, Dawes, Dubi and/or Callahan.

For the last 10-11 games the Rangers had on any given night, maybe a player or two (okay maybe three) that would have a tough game. Most of the bad play and mistakes were in large masked by Henrik Lundqvist. The domino's are starting to fall. It has become more than one or two players a night having tough games. It has got to the point where we are trying to find one or two players that have a 'good' game. This team is out of sync in all facets of the game, excluding the PK & goaltending. It may be a combination of Renney's system and the players within the system. Is it that these are not the right players to play Renney's system? Is it the system that leads us to a low scoring, lack lustre, error prone style of play? I am sure everyone has their comments, but what we are seeing right NOW is a .500 hockey club. Forget about the hot start, it's about NOW. After 20+ games we all know what we have NOW. There's a lot of fixing to be done and NOW is the time for it...before it's too late....and hopefully it's not too late already.

D-Bear yeah FIRE PEARN!....this is the talent. Maybe he needs Crosby, Malikin, & Staal? Let him get a job in Pitts. He has to go now, so ALL get the message. He has had three years of SHOOT THE PUCK that he can't get done. You can't fire 3 teams, you fire at least the coach directly responsible for the PP that can win games if it scores TIMELY goals. Add to that HE wanted Redden. It's called accountability... GOODBYE & GOOD LUCK MR PEARN!

JESS I don't think Schonefeld would take the job, but if he would he's got my vote. Sather needs to hire Burke, this thing has gotten STALE. Let him bring a coach in if Schonefeld won't step up for the TEAM.

it's become a rerun every season, they need some new writers.

this team is not disciplined and plays with no direction or plan. whatever coaching renney is doing is apparently not working. the team is thinking too much and the fact that there is no accountability for poor play among the vets the rookies are constantly playing nervous. renney is not even handed with his benchings and i think its hurting the young players play. scoenfeld needs to replace both sather and renney before the season slips away. sather is so lost that he is returning this team to the fat cat days, poor signings and players looking for the last big contact. the team reflects the coaches personality, we need a coach with an edge.

I really love how everybody is getting on the "I hate Tom Renney* bandwagon. I still have faith in Renney. He is a great coach, it aint his fault that the players dont shoot or show up sometimes.

Renney has an edge, you honestly dont know what goes on inside the lockerroom. You guys want your cake and eat it too. We need a goal scorer not a new coach. Look how dumb Tampa looks for firing Torts then firing Barry. Tampa is like lost when it comes to coaching. Of course we can all speculate, but at the end of the day we dont work for the Rangers and Tom is still the coach. Deal with it.

Dallas right now is 6-9-4 and last in the West. Avery has 2 goals in 17 games. That's all that should be said about the "Avery-factor."

sorry jagrmiester i don't agree. What edge does renney have. He shows absolutely no emotion behind the bench. He takes everything the refs and his team throw in his face without ever flinching.He gives them the day off after a dismal performance. There response is to not get a shot on goal for the first 13 minutes of the next game and spend the first 8 minutes in the penalty box. Maybe he can teach yoga or meditation since it his team has stalled in new york. and don't compare tampa or any other team with the rangers. If so try the red wings

I have seen Renney get pissed. Its rare, but sometimes he does. He gave them a day off cause everyone needs a break, people have lives. Sometimes days off wake people up. I shouldnt compare any team to the rangers? Ok how is this the Rangers are the Mets. Pompous players who think they own New York.

He didnt compare Ranegrs to TB he showed an example of what ight happen if they fire Renney.You can compare Redwings to us look at their team and stars their coach has to coach and look what Renney got.Datsyuk Zetterberg,Holmstrom,Franzen Hossa,Lidstrom,Rafalski.Renney got Gomez Zherdev,cally dawes voros,naslund,redden.See what im saying?Witht he team det got i think a peewee leage coach can get them to the cup finals

i was only using the redwings as the opposite end of the spectrum from tampa bay i was not comparing the rangers to them. get real.
I only concern myself with the rangers. i also don't want to hear about players lives and they need a day off as far as im concerned they take their day's off during the alot of these games. If we performed in your jobs like some of these guys do we would be adding to the evere increasing unemployment number. and they get paid a hell of alot more than we do to PLAY HOCKEY for a living.
If giving the rangers a day off wakes the rangers up then i would give them a week off. and im not talking about the cup finals im talking about competing every night. this team not only takes shifts off but whole periods.

You never take a day off from work.Meaning making a mistake or two?Feeling lazy? If you say no then you are a liar.The only difference is they have thousands of people up their asses noticing that you dont.It doesnt matter how much they get paid.Its non fo our concern.If you come to work and you have 10 of your coworkers booing you everytime you touch a pen or whatever you do how would you eb able to perform??

after noticing that put a ,

ros I disagree on the avery factor, but it's a mistake already made, too late.Have fun proving no point.

one bad day would go unnoticed but nit weeks worth. the holy than thou crap dosen't cut it.

this is entertainment. his fellows workers aren't booing him its the paying spectators

You sound like somebody i know..

Yes they are lazy i agree. They dont show up during a whole period yes. Thats why you drink before the game sooo you dont know what is going on afterwards. I honestly careless they are stressing me out more than the election did.

that's why they get paid the BIG Buck$....

So if u get paid big bucks which shouldnt concern you you automaticaly become non human and u not allowed to make mistakes?


The point is if someboyd would boo you or chanted asshole at u during your work i doubt ull be able to perform same way.Us fans have to be supportive and assholes who come to the game just to boo shouldnt be fans.Essp those who say i pay money i can do whatever i want.Fans are there to support ive been to a lot of arenas and i see how other home fans act.And our fans are the biggest dicks.Garden is only loud in the 1st 20 secs and next time it gets liud is when we on top.If we down by 1 you can hear the conversation that taking place across the arena.And no dont tell me to go root for another team.Im just stating that Rangers fans not say all but a lot are there to act up/showoff cause somehow its kool to boo the player on your team because itll really help him to get his confidence.Same problem i ahve with fans when we on PP i dont mind booing when they cant get it going,but boo them when they chaning lines is pathetic.Then you have the infamaous SHOOT people who dont know hockey,They yell Shoot when the player shoots and its blocked or wide they yell NOOOO.The point is we have to help them by cheering them on not sit and blame Renney.Just remember 97-2004 seasons BEFORE Renney got here.Think how much you enjoyed watching devils in the playoffs

I totally disagree with your perspective on the players being "all high and mighty." There's adrenaline on the ice and testosterone. This is hockey, what do you expect. There not playing with egos, there playing with intensity and mental game. Wake up - it has NOTHING to do with high and mighty. Totally ridiculous comment.

Hey ant if your read all my messages i gave credit to renney for adding structure, getting his players in shape and getting them tothis level. I also said I feel this team has flatlined and needs a different man to take them to the next level. Remember Roger nielson. He got the rangers to the playoffs every year but it took keenan to get them over the top. i know keenan wears out his welcome in the long run but i truly believe renney has reached his limit with the team and they need an infusion of vigor and spirit. maybe these players can't muster it up but then thats sathers fault for putting the wrong pieces together. either way something needs to give.
and by the way not everybody says those things at the game and in the case of a guy like rosival he has had a few years here before he started hearing the boos and he knew what he was getting into when he resigned. problem is he took the best money offered and has to endure the consequences for continuos bad performances

also ant you act as if the rangers are the only players that get booed. i don't know how many arenas you have been too but every team gets booed by their fans when things go bad and cheers when they are good. I agree you should go to games to support your team which i do,but how do you support and applaud bad efforts night in and night out by many of the players without letting them know how you feel.
all i did was make an observation about renney and this team. i personally don't boo and curse at them.... but i do shake my head in disbelief at the same mistakes happening almost every game even the ones that they win because are goalie bails them out

time for sunday football on MY DAY OFF. Wonder what the rangers are doing today. GO GIANTS and JETS

It wasn't lack of enforcers that caused us to lose our cool, hell, it was probably moreso a case of everyone on the team thinking they're the teams' enforcers. Guys like Ruutu aren't scared of anyone, they've got their own enforcers who will fight their battles for them and they'll rarely throw the mitts. This is why I think Sean Avery is a step above some of these tools, at least he'll answer the bell and fight when people take exception to his antics.

they are at your house Al.

Go Jets more alikely Go Brett Favre :) He still looks great at his age for some reason.

Al im talking about booing individuals and not trying to cheer the team up when they down a goal or 2

Ant, do you boooo Alex Rodriguez?

Nope because hes here for MANY MANY MANY years just like rozie and redden

different. This is Redden's first year booing is allowed. He is not even a real Ranger. Why does he get to wear the A? and not Rozy?

If you ask me i think Alex would play alot better than Redden on D. Madonna can be in the net on henrik's off nights.

Are people actually arguing that the NHL players need a day off? They get days off. It's called the months of June July August and part of September. I dont count working out in the gym a couple hours a day work. Who here has a job that gives them 4 months off and pays them millions of dollars? I dont. I work 60 hours a week for 50 weeks a year. These guys need days off? Give me a break.

He got the A only in Ott game other games Betts had it.

Jive whos arguing about them needing a day off??

should have given it to someone else. I am just not a big Redden fan which is obvious. But i do love Michal Rozsival.

This team sucks! I have liked the old team better. At least they were exciting to watch. Rangers have not had a decent game in over a month. This is just plain with no flavor to it... I miss JJ and Avery. They need a trade for agitator like Tootoo. Broadway puff balls!

i dont understand why we didnt sign ruutu ov er voros

Kirill - if you think the team sucks, why are you spending your energy in this forum. Go find something else to do with your time. I'm sick of people puttting the Rangers down. We're number 1 in the conference right now; let's start the ranting when we start to slip significantly. Its like you have nothing better to do.

Booing is absurd. Get a life and just imagine you on the ice hearing your fans to that to you.
I'm glad we don't have Ruutu...he is probably agitating off the ice too. That would piss anyone off.
Orr needs to step up and fight. Mara is willing to, but he's not a fighter all around.
Chara is good, but he's not that good...he's just a very big player.
So enough talk about what we "should've" done.
Same goes for Avery - he's gone. MOVE ON.

Tootoo and Weber for Prucha, sanguinetti and a second round draft pick

Nice proposal. Im sure the Preds are drooling to trade a heart and soul player and their second leading scorer, stud 23 year old defenseman for a healthy scratch, shaky defense prospect and a second rounder. Why not just ask for Arnott and Suter too while we're at it.

I'm sorry my trade proposals don't meet your expectations. I guess I dont have as much smarts as you.

"We're number 1 in the conference right now; let's start the ranting when we start to slip significantly."

Oh no we're not. Statistically, taking those extra games into account, we are 5th in the conference and dropping like a rock. 4 wins in the last 10 games with two of those going to a shootout. "MOVING ON?" At the rate the Rangers are moving on, we will be out of the playoffs by January.

Get your head outta the sand, ostrich.

blukub -- You exemplify the problem I have with the coverage that we provide here, specifically, why I waste my time with the coverage when people like you just ignore it (and that of other reporters). You label my comments about the players being "high and mighty" as totally ridiculous despite the reporting by people on site in Ottawa quoting Mara and Valiquette as getting all high and mighty about their acts or non-acts with respect to Ruutu. Meanwhile, Ruutu himself is quoted as being gleeful about getting the job done his way.

In this case, I can't claim to have reported that stuff myself, since I didn't travel to Ottawa for yesterday's game, but all those quotes I excerpted the other day were from my original reporting from the Garden. But it seems that some fans, you included, are just not interested in the facts, you're only interested in your own opinions. Well, I'm not interested in just providing you and others like you a forum to express your unsupported opinions. If you want to make the most of this site, take out a subscription, learn what is actually happening, and then feel confident in voicing a credible opinion rather than just telling other people to wake up when you are so obviously sleepwalking.

The comments to this entry are closed.