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June 20, 2008

Comments

del zotto is a big name and the Rangers always go for the big name. Absolutely no suprise there.

Damn! I'm not crazy about this pick. Jordan Eberle was right there for the taking but he's now an Oiler at 22. He was my man.

i don't see anything wrong with drafting the most talented guy available. jess seems to believe that the rangers should be concerned now with pairings. this guy won't be in the league for years. Half the players the rangers suit up won't be here either. in fact, the rangers will probably draft someone in the 5th round who will be better than all the young players we're talking about.

monotonix

absolutely who knows what these players will do in the future but Del Zotto has talent and that is most important. If Colton Orr can learn to play defense than anyone can...

oleosmith
marek malik never learned how to play defense. lol

bones, thank god you are just an armchair GM. you would draft the entire smurf village.

I think this will put some pressure on Sags. The kid was rated above Doughty at the beginning of this season, but slipped. At least we went for defense. Our next pick should be very interesting.

woah who got Cammalleri???

Dubi

They mentioned on the broadcast that he actually came into the combine at 196, after realizing he needed to be in better shape...good sign about the kid's maturity. Also, I loved hearing that his play stepped up in the playoffs.

damn Cammalleri to the Flames. him and Iginla are gonna be nasty together

Didn't the post say that The Rangers were not going to talk to Jaromir Jagr prior to July 1st?

But watching the draft during our pick the TSN dudes said that Jagr's agent had a sitdown with the Rangers the day before ... so really now ... did they talk to him to tell him that they were going to wait until July 1st? Or are they trying to lock him up before July 1st?

I don't know much about our pick, kid looks good and the TSN peeps gave him props ... need to go back and read the 150+ posts on the other thread to see what Jess thinks ;)

Rangers are obviously focusing on the power play which can win alot of games in the NHL.
Also bet they pursue Campbell hard and have Drury making a few calls.

From Hockey News Preview:

Del Zotto..."I don't think he is far off Doughty", a scout said. "He hasn't had the consistent type of year Doughty had, but he's very good."

Jess,

Looking at Carlson...I wonder what the hell the Rangers are thinking. Kid is a house and we let him go to another team in our conference.

I am not saying that Del Zotto isn't a good player but other teams are growing trees and we go after daisies.

Man, it not easy being a Ranger fan!

Burke robs Maloney.

I Carlson had to be in the east, I am glad Philly traded him to the Caps.

If I'm not mistaken, Woodlief loved Jessiman.

Down on Del Zotto huh Jess?

I say I like the kid, I was surprised we picked him because he is an offensive D-Man and we have Sangs coming up but given how horribly inept our PP is I am also not shocked that in the future the team never wants this to be an issue again ... as far as who he will be paired with well ... he certainly won't be playing in the NHL next season or even the one after so perhaps that doesn't matter right at this moment ...

But I would love a big time physical D-Man so I would've wanted the dude you wanted just for that ... but I can't be upset about who we got either ... sigh ...

BTW did Bettman's face crack under the strain of smiling at the Rangers brass or does he reserve his hatred jut for Dolan?

Well, you would think that one of Sanguinetti or Del Zotto will pan out. Once again, we take a guy that slips down. Now, we wait another 20 picks to go again. Bet that Jordan Staal is gone by then.

Just Saw Love Guru..which had Rob Blake
in it ...pretty funny ..great to see another movie which features some hockey..
props to Mike Myers

Not sure what to think about with this pick. From what I hear he seems to be very, very similar to Sanguinetti. If I'm Slats, it makes sense to take someone who's the best player on the board, but at the same time I think the Rangers would have been better served taking Carlson, a project pick that could very well be a shutdown, stay-at-home type that can man the blueline for years, with a plus shot on the power play.

What this might be telling us is that the Rangers are buying into the Red Wings draft strategy - build from the blueline with guys that can move the puck and have some offensive skills. However, given the draft record the Rangers have displayed, I'm concerned that they ignored other needs, such as a physical winger or center (Greg Nemisz, anyone?) or a stay-at-home d-man such as Carlson. Either way, the Rangers are going with a guy who may turn out to be a Mathieu Schneider or Sergei Zubov-esque power play quarterback, or turn out to be someone like Mike Mottau. I don't dislike the pick, but I think Slats and Co. could have come up with something better this time around. Let's hope Jared Staal slips Cherepanov-style to 51, although I doubt that will happen.

Reposting. Heh heh.

Sanguenetti and Del Zotto. Clearly this is a blatant attempt by the Rangers to appeal to, and increase, their Long Island/NJ/Sopranos fan base. That's a joke, folks. Don't get your knickers in a twist.

First notes on Del Zotto.

1. He's got Al Montoya's hair! Again, going for the LI/NJ base.

2. His shirt/tie combination will put Al Trautwig in a tizzy fit.

3. He may have a knock on him for hockey immaturity--but his interview maturity is quite good (does better than Hollweg, for sure). He sounded articulate, calm and balanced.

4. Hugs Score:

Overall: 8

Minuses for too many.

Pluses for genuine emotion, lots of smiles. Most were brief. A few too long, but they looked like family or friends, so no deductions because those are important.

So we'll see what the kid's all about soon enough. The hair gel's gotta go, tho'.

If we really want to get jared staal we will get him. It will be easier to trade in the second round than to trade down in the first round. I really do think a trade maybe prucha and our 2 and 3 rd pick would do the job of getting him. Thats a lot in a deep draft though so we will see what happens. remember we arent the only team with a staal on it. Carolina and Pitt might be interested as other teams obviously

Matty

Don't talk to Jess. He talked "smack" about you in the last thread.

Btw, the above photo is a bit too provocative for some of us. And since I'm old enough to be his, uh, er, oldest sister, I think it should come down. Not immediately! But, you know, eventually.

I vote to keep the above photo ...

BTW Lisa, I read all the digs Jess took but he'll get his soon enough

monotonix

jess seems to believe that the rangers should be concerned now with pairings. this guy won't be in the league for years.

Not pairings NEED. Tell me who on the Rangers is going to clear the crease? The Rangers lack someone who is going to go out there and be that physical presence Ranger fans have been asking for.

Matty

need to go back and read the 150+ posts on the other thread to see what Jess thinks ;)

And I expect a well written response from you as Lisa is trying to steal your crown.

Seriously though it is not that I dislike Del Zotto but he is not what the Rangers needed for their needs. Del Zotto just might become a great scorer BUT if he does not play strong enough defense then the Rangers still have a hole.

BTW did Bettman's face crack under the strain of smiling at the Rangers brass or does he reserve his hatred jut for Dolan?

Bettman does not hate Junior IMO but rather fears him as a threat to his rule. Junior despite our dislike of him has a very valid question which is: Why can't the Rangers market themselves instead of being stuck with this generic "I love Crosby" nonsense?

The other thing that scares Bettman is that Junior will not forget what Bettman is trying to do to him and Junior will remind Bettman that he works for the owners not the other way arround.

Jas

If I'm not mistaken, Woodlief loved Jessiman.

Not sure if that was the case but when I was sitting next to him at the 06 draft, he was singing the praises of the Anisimov selection and warned about Lafleur last year.


Adam

Sorry but I can live without Jared Staal as most of his hype comes because of his last name.

Last season he struggled with his game so one has to wonder just how badly he wants to play hockey.

I feel for a kid who has 3 brothers ahead of him already in the NHL as he is constantly compared to them.

Lisa

Repostings tsk tsk, Matty never reposts but I forget you are still a rookie (who was doing laundry on draft night another demerit for you)

Lisa

And since I'm old enough to be his, uh, er, oldest sister, I think it should come down. Not immediately! But, you know, eventually.

Older Sister? You mean you are a Nun with a potty mouth and tattle tale?


Jess

So who's your target for #51 tomorrow...#75, too?

I am way bummed about this pick.

Woodlief, 04/15/08:

"(H)is skating and balance are poor, and his defensive zone positioning is awful. He simply cannot read developing plays quickly and react properly."

Last year wasted 2nd rd pick on that goalie. This year...

Good thing new guys are running the draft.

"E.J. Maguire calls Del Zotto, who wears #4 in honor of Bobby Orr, "the new breed offensive defenseman who jumps up into the rush effectively; he either follows up a rush to add a second dimension or is capable of leading the rush himself."

Like in what universe is that "new breed"?

"He continues to improve defensively on a daily basis." His GM, Brad Selwood, said.

That quote is moronic! "On a daily basis"? wtf

"I'm trying to work on my game right now to be an all–around defenseman."

How about "I'm working to be an all around defenseman"? Who's writing these quotes?

"I got off to a slow start but I really wanted to focus on my defensive game."

Good Gawd!

"I've found the best way to shut down a player is not having them have the puck."

How about "crushing a guy is the best way to shut down a guy"?

"Whenever they have the puck, I get a chance to play the body and make them not want to come back into my corner."

Oooh...very scary!

"He's a great passer with a good shot," said TSN analyst Pierre McGuire. "Maturity is a question mark."

Great...just what we need! He could make us all forget about Roszival. I don't even want to speculate about that second part.

""There probably isn’t a defenseman in this class that has a higher offensive upside than Michael Del Zotto."

Yeah right! Guess that's why Dubi won't vouch for it. "Above and beyond normal"? wtf

Woodlief, again:

"(H)is decision making in his own end can be downright atrocious, and hockey sense is not something you can work on or acquire, as with some other skills."

At least he's "cute".

*sigh*

Jess

Potty mouth? Hardly. But when it comes to sports, well...

Nun? Bwahahahahahaha!

Tattletale? No way! Matty and I have to have each others backs because of you. You started it.

And laundry waits for no one. Let me guess, you don't do the laundry in your household, do you?

Jess

Serious question. Could the slight downturn in Del Zotto's game last season have to do with him concentrating more on the defensive part of his game instead of being so offensive (offencive?) minded?

Jess: Unfair and half truthed comment when you said Sanguinetti had twice as many goals as Del Zotto this year.

This was Sanguinetti's 4th year in junior hockey and he was playing as a 20 year old so you are comparing, to a certian extent, apples and oranges. Lets look and see what he did his first two years in junior as an 18 year old and compare that to Del Zotto's first two years in junior as an 18 year old.

Sanguinetti's 1st year: 4 goals and 20 assists, 2nd year: 14 goals and 51 assists.

Del Zotto's 1st year: 10 goals and 47 asissts, 2nd year 16 goals and 47 assists.

Sanguinetti 1st 2 years: 18 goals, 71 assists, 89 points.

Del Zotto's 1st 2 years: 26 goals, 94 assists, 120 points.

Del Zotto's offensive numbers are superior to Sanguinetti's at similar points in their junior careers.

I think that is a more valid comparison than talking about a 20 year olds stats who had been to 2 NHL prospects and training camps to those of an 18 year old that just got drafted.

Everyone said Sanguinetti had to work on his defensive game as his offense was there.

Their saying the same thing about Del Zotto.

Maybe you had your reasons for liking and wanting to draft Carlson but Del Zotto was ranked 17th by ISS, 15th by the Hockey News and 15th by Central Scouting among North American skaters, all well ahead of Carlson.

This is not a bad pick or a bad player.

It is just one you disagreed with.

Del Zotto's defensive play in his second season improved much more than Sanguinetti's did in his second year.

I like the pick and think Del Zotto might develop into a better all around defenseman than Sanguinetti.

Only time will tell.

Like the pick of Del Zotto, not a Cherepanov but a good steal.

http://www.nyhockeyrivalry.com

Jess - my gut instinct from reading some of the pre draft hype is the same as yours on who we should have taken defensively. never saw either player but this guy seems of the same mindset of poti and ozo. to me that type player is Sather's fatal flaw. it's not always easy being a fan of this team but it's too late I bleed blue.

Just out of curiosity.. what about Jared Staal? Anybody think that would be a good 2nd round pick? I mean hes got the name I just don't know if hes got the talent...

OK Jas

51 doubt EITHER of these guys will be there BUT Mitch Wahl (Spokane)or Cory Feinhage (HS). Maybe a Derek Grant of Langley of BCHL or Eric Mestery of Tri-City and as a reach Jimmy Hayes who is more end 2nd to top 3rd

75 If Dustin Tokarski is still there GRAB HIM as this kid is going to be an NHL starting goalie. He is not pretty but boy he knows how to win and the bigger the game the better he plays. Others include Brodie Reid of Buranby (BCHL), and a gamble here Ian Schultz of Calgary who's big brother is Jeff of the Caps and he plays a lot like him at the same age.

Ron B

Unfair and half truthed comment when you said Sanguinetti had twice as many goals as Del Zotto this year.

So Ron care to tell me who Sanguinetti had on his team in Owen Sound during his first 2 seasons since you are accusing me of dishonesty here?

Del Zotto's 1st 2 years: 26 goals, 94 assists, 120 points.

OK Ron since you are accusing me of being "half truthed" tell me how many of those assists were primary setting up his teammates John Tavares and Brett MacLean?

Can I accuse you know of using unfair and half truth comments now? I mean really do you even know how many points either MacLean or Tavares had last season? Try 119 and 118 so please give me a break here?

Now Ron while you are comparing the 2 tell me which future first pick of the NHL drafts did Sanguinetti play with during his first 2 seasons?

Please I get told that Del Zotto has a greater offensive upside than Sanguinetti but nobody takes into account who his teammates are

Tell me Ron how many games did it take for Del Zotto to score his first goal of the season? How many goals did he have by mid season?

If you want to trash me using stats then why not point out that Del Zotto really only had one good month (7) where he scored most of his goals.

In Sanguinetti's time with OS he was always consistent good or bad.

Sanguinetti played on some suspect Owen Sound teams and never played with the kind of talent that Del Zotto has.

Maybe you had your reasons for liking and wanting to draft Carlson but Del Zotto was ranked 17th by ISS, 15th by the Hockey News and 15th by Central Scouting among North American skaters, all well ahead of Carlson.

My main reason starts with MY OWN EYES as I saw plenty of Carlson since his Indiana Ice played Danny Hobb's Junior Bluejackets 8 times. I saw a prospect who is mean, is nasty and is still growing.

Del Zotto's Generals plays against Sanguinetti's Troop since they are in the same conference.

As for the rankings they are so subjective as should I use what Paul A did with Kyly Woodlief's report as he had him 32nd? How about McKeen's who had him 28th. Which rankings are the best to use Ron?

Other than CSB for contact information I try to avoid using those paid "scouting" reports because everyone has their own taste.

Del Zotto's defensive play in his second season improved much more than Sanguinetti's did in his second year.

I like the pick and think Del Zotto might develop into a better all around defenseman than Sanguinetti.

Based on what? How many games did you watch him in action? What evidence do offer besides what someone else wrote that says this will happen

Do you even know the name of either prospect's junior coach? And oh heck yes it does make a huge difference here as one prospect was coached by one of the best teachers in all of hockey

The other's coach has been a OHL head coach for not even 40 games and yet you are so sure about this.

Lisa

Actually I think it was the result of some poor coaching more than what the kid did. Yes the kid was perhaps concentrating too much on defense but then it should have been the coach who pulls him aside and tells the kid to be himself and not try to force feed a learning curve.

People do not realize that we are dealing with teenagers (or have forgotten what it was like to be one) as Del Zotto is not even 18.

The Rangers just might be the very first REAL coaching the kid ever has received in his career.


And I know people will ask
I saw Carlson twice in Indianapolis (family there Oct/Dec) 3 times on the tube and twice via the web and one scouting DVD a friend sent me

Jess,

I couldn't agree with you more. I never heard of Carlson before you mentioned him here and never seen him play but when they called his name and he started walking to the podium...all I could see was MASS. He is huge and if he plays with an edge we will regret this like we have regretted the Jessiman pick for years to come.

Gordie Clark is a very good scout...in fact, excellent, but I wonder if he got caught up in perceived rankings or is he is trying to recreate the Leetch - Zubov pairing, Italian style.

Is there a guy in 2nd round who can bring what Carlson will give the Caps in a few years.
Think about going up against the Caps when they have the Big O, Semin, the rookie from this year and Carlson on the backline detroying people. Man o man why do they do this to us.

Sather is a buffoon. He is making Snow look good. His ego is too big...why didn't he trade the 20 move down 3 or 4 slots and pick up another 2nd like you stated all along and we could have still gotten Carlson or Del Zotto.

Jess, you nailed this draft and several GM's as well, unfortunately for us, Sather was plaining his next vacation at this draft.


Jess,

I agree the rangers need that physical presence but that is now that they need it. I think that will be addressed July 1.

The Del Zotto pick was a good one. Best player at the pick they had, barring a trade up/down this was a good pick.

One thing that seems to hold true with these players is you can improved their defensive game but if they don't have the skills offensively or have the ability to make plays with poise then you can not teach that.

I'm not a scout but Gordie Clark is as good as it gets.

Rangers Grade: B+

I'll admit it up front: I don't know a thing about any of the players who were drafted last night or today. When they come up to the big club is when I get a real read on them. However, from what I've read from some so called "draftniks," the Rangers drafted themselves a very talented player, with tons of potential. At this age, who knows what they will turn into. I'll leave it up to the guys who get paid to make these evaluations. Afterall, its their necks on the line, not ours!
It is worth noting, however, that the so-called "next Scott Stevens" was also passed over by the original Scott Stevens' employers: even though they have never even come close to replacing him since he retired. Just a thought.

Memo to "joeymole" : hey genius, tell me where I went wrong in summing up the state of the franchise. Come down from your ecstasy trip and take an objective look at a franchise that is ridiculed throughout the league; a GM who mailed it in a long time ago; and a team of pieces that don't fit together.
I wish we were moving closer to being an elite team, but until the smoke clears in Sept., what's there now is barely a playoff team.
Come out of your mole hole and nibble on this....

When Carlson was selected, McKenzie said he has all the tools to be a "hard hitting, hard shooting, in your face, physical defensemen." He also mentioned he had NHL calibur skating.

Anyone get a chance to talk to the Rangers scouting about it? Be interesting what they have to say.

So we'll keep an eye on his career and see how he compares to Del Zotto. He sounds like a player that the rangers could use in the present and future.

Also,

In three to five years, here's LA's blueline.
Johnson, Doughty, Teubert, and Hickey.

In nets, they'll have Bernier.

They have the potential to have a real nasty blueline.

Does anyone know when they start the second round? I know its not on TV.

Del Zotto has skills and is a good physical specimen--his problem may be between the ears, although he sounded very focused during the interview. Jameson--what is wrong with smurfs, a lot of them were drafted yesterday in case you didn't notice. Just keep your eye on Eberle and in 3 years we'll talk. Nick Kypreos just reported that the Rangers are VERY interested in Mats Sundin. This is good, lets hope they land him which also might get JJ very excited to come back.

No Thank you for Mats Sundin. I do not want him and didnt his rights go to another team already or is that just rumoured? I rather just Keep this team young and take our chances with that. Trust me If we get Sundin and Jagr doesnt come back its a waste cause Sundin is not taking us to the promise land. lol

My reflection:

Del Zotto is a clear indication that the Rangers feel they MUST have AT LEAST one offensive minded blueliner. That means Rozsival, Backman and Pock are not in the future plans of the Rangers. They may keep Rozi for this year or play Pock to help get them through till Sags and/or Del Zotto show NHL readiness. It also tells me that they plan on hiring the hitting defensemen they need. So I think the period after July 1st will be active for the Rangers. Orpik, Commodore, Sauer and a few more could be targets for us. If this is their plan, then the JJ signing will take place AFTER all is set. It will be the 2 year deal he is looking for. Straka, Shanahan, Mara, Malik and Backman will all be gone.

adam,

you can watch the draft live on nhl.com

Geez Jess just because I disagreed with you I "trashed you"? Why did you take that so personally?

What you just did to me was to try and BELITTLE me in front of my fellow Ranger fans and Blueshirt Bulletin readers. Tell me my opinion is worth nothing because I did not do and see all that you did. Tell me the paid scouts opinions mean nothing compare to the scouting guides YOU use. Told me essentially, you were the expert, what did I know and that my opinion was misguided because....well...it was my opinion based on what I have read, heard and yes, seen.

Sorry Jess, but aren't you better than that?

Half-truthed had nothing to do with dishonesty. Half-truthed meant you were comparing a 20 year olds stats that had 2 pro prospects and training camps and a stint in Hartford with a kid that is 17 years old and won't turn 18 until next week!

MY bad I said he Del Zotto was 18. He is but 17 and won't turn 18 until June 24!!!

Isn't it true that you were comparing a 20 year old seasoned junior to a 17 year old "kid"?

Of course I knew you would come back with "look who Del Zotto played with"!

Was that Del Zotto's fault and does that diminish the fact he played well with them? Does that take away from the fact that Del Zotto was rated higher than Carlson?

"Sanguinetti played on some suspect Owen Sound teams and never played with the kind of talent that Del Zotto has".

Jess, you conveniently "forgot" to mention that Sanguinetti played with 1st rounder Cody Hodgson this year at Brampton.

Didn't Sanguinetti play with the 2nd pick overall in 2005, Bobby Ryan in his 3 years at Owen Sound?

Were those guys chopped liver? Is that supposed to diminish Sanguinetti's accomplishments....or inflate them like you accuse Del Zotto of?

"Do you even know the name of either prospect's junior coach? And oh heck yes it does make a huge difference here as one prospect was coached by one of the best teachers in all of hockey.
The other's coach has been a OHL head coach for not even 40 games and yet you are so sure about this".

Jess, sorry, you are way off base here. I will come back at that self serving remark by simply saying if Del Zotto was rated so high with such a poor coach just think what he will turn in to when the Rangers system gets a hold of him.


If you have the Cablevision Versus package it is on the NHL network, channel 401 in Northwest NJ.

Jess -- I know you're under the impression that the entire Rangers organization will be built from within, but that's a fantasy (or we would have had a Rice, Mallette, DeBrusk first line instead of a Cup.) You pick the best player available. Who is going to clear the crease? In 3-4 years, who cares?

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