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August 08, 2008

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repost....what's with the double standard? Guys can come here for the money, but can't leave here for money. I have no problem with Jagr & Avery, they were good NYR.

Carry over

The thing with Avery is that he was not the one who was trashing the Rangers first it was the other way around.

The Rangers were trashing Avery via the Maven from before free agency began.

I am not saying I wanted Avery back but rather think that given what the Rangers were saying about him being a problem in the locker room when there was no evidence to support is crass.

Avery had a right to say what he did in Dallas in my book and if anything I think Avery actually toned it down.

The Rangers are going to have some huge boots to fill in the Aves Dept. Not only could he get under your skin,but he would speard an infection as his wrist shots from the slot found the back of the net. Good luck Aves now your a "TX" Ranger.

Dubi, Did I miss something? All of the sudden nobody can comment on the BB side. Why is that? When I try all I get is "Comment to this entry is closed." Any particular reason for that?

i

I think the problem is the "double standard" that Avery used. He "bleads Red, White & Blue"? Then he trashes the organization as "loosers"? That's the problem and that is why people posted what thay did. He bleeds "green"! Nothing wrong with that, just say you went for the money, not to pick a "winning club".

Oh, and let me add one more thing. Sather doesn't like folks who take him to arbitration. He can get past that if the upside is actually there. However, in the case of Avery, I think Sather had him as a scratch from the get go. The release of some of the Rangers arguments against the Avery claim was sleazy. I think that spelled the end of Avery in a Rangers uniform more then anything.

RB seems to be more than enough sour grapes to go around on all sides of the Avery story. Without many facts except for what he signed for. The rest seems to be a lot of speculation & opinion. What he said is Avery being Avery. You like on your team, you don't when he's your opponent. He's got it down to a science, but it also can wear on people on his side. He's controversial, and keeps hockey from being predictable.If both teams offers were similar, which team do you think he'd rather be with? Besides liking NYC, he liked NYR fans & the NYR.

I think where Avery overstepped his bounds here was to directly criticize other players. Rarely do players say such things about each other.

I think there is an unspoken code among players that they not trash the abilities of their peers, with rare exceptions. I can only guess why. I'd say in part it is because they know how difficult what they do really is, and that they get enough crap from know-nothing fans. If you were a player, you would probably think his remarks show a disrespect for the entire profession.

I'd bet that most Rangers were pissed at his actions and words directed at Marty Brodeur, who isn't even fat. And I'd bet not many Stars are thrilled to hear him talk this way about classy and successful pros such as Redden and Naslund. It's going to be a long four years in Dallas.

Sorry Jess,

I do not agree with you ... so because the management of the Rangers talked smack about him that gives him the right to do it back to the entire team, the city, ect? Because he did that ... He should talk about Sather or Hope ... There was NO reason for him to talk smack about classy players like Naslund and Redden ... although I am fully aware that he was just doing what he always does which is to bring attention to himself by being a jerk ... It's part of his act and I get it, he wanted people to talk about him, to be upset at him or to praise him for being classless ... fine he's accomplished his goal ...

The Bottom line for Ranger Fans:
Avery is no longer a blueshirt. F him and his wussie fashion crap. He's the enemy now.

My message to Sean:
Have fun in Texas, Sean. Living in Dallas will surely help your fashion career. Wait does GQ have a branch office there?
Don't you just hate how the back and gold and green in your new uniform clashes? Isn't it icky, Sean? Maybe Brett will let you re-design them? I bet he'll model for you too... One last question, how long is it going to take you to realize that even if you are on a better team no one is watching, and that's all you care about, isn't it, Sean?

As much as I loved to see the Rangers put a major hurt on the Devils last season, I still didn't think Avery's "Fatso" remark about Brodeur had any place in the game. It was out of line. Yeah, I laughed and replayed the tape blah, blah, blah, but when you think about it, do we really want a guy like that on the team? After Brodeur refused to shake Avery's hand, Avery should have left it at that. He had won that war. Win with some class and keep your mouth shut. Avery was definitely a spark, but too volatile and too much outside of what the Rangers are trying to build (or at least we are hoping they are trying to build).

NCSteve,
I completely agree. He was a guilty pleasure. You laugh, but you know you shouldn't.
Bill

What would anyone expect Avery to say? He still loves the NYR and the off-season moves made by the Rangers? He has lunch with Marty once a week? Sean Avery is Sean Avery...PERIOD. This all comes with the package that Dallas now has to manage. We all know that Sean takes it to the limit in everything he says and does..when that doesn't happen than we all will be asking what's wrong with him. This is normal and business as usual.....

Hey everyone! How goes it? I'm back.

Jess wrote, "The Rangers were trashing Avery via the Maven from before free agency began."

Serious question: Is Stan "Devils Announcer" Fischler considered part of the Rangers organization? When Glen needs a media pit bull he chews a cigar, gets on the horn and calls...the Maven?

As for Sean himself...oh well. Would've liked to have seen him in blue for another season. But that's the past. Happy Trails!

I'm hoping to find a link of him throwing out the first pitch at the NYY@TX game last night. Just to see what he was wearing in that unbearable heat!

And like most of you, I'll miss him, until Naslund's first goal, or a Dawes hattrick or something.

I will miss Avery in the red, white and blue. His fatso comment about Marty was hysterical and frankly I have no problem with it.

Marty had disrespected the Rangers for years...just because maybe his words weren't as childish doesn't make it any better.

Hockey is a battle. Avery recognized that the Rangers were not a prolific goal scoring team last year and that playing the devils, who who yielded little and played great defense, he needed to do what it takes to win. And for that series he did. He got into Marty's head. Marty refused to shake Avery's hand not b/c of his stick waving but because he was beaten by him. Sore loser and I have zero sympathy for him in that regards. Be a man and shake his hand.

If Avery had maliciously taken out a player, a la Claude Lemuix, or something along those lines, then I am all for not shaking his hand.. but just because he bruised Marty's ego, sorry not buying it...

Enough about that I am excited for this season!! Can't wait to see what Zherdev can do! I don't think we had a player of his flashy offensive ability since the short stay of The Russian Rocket...

Going to miss Jags but I truly believe this team needed to "pass the leadership torch".

Hey Andrea,
Here's the link: http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nhl/photo?slug=177c43787703073de89bf10abd93661c-getty-80320538rm007_new_york_yank&prov=getty

I used to have the same feelings about Fischler (that he was a Devils loyalist)...but he is in fact a great hockey person and a great Ranger fan...not to mention a great New Yorker. My wife got me his book on the history of the Rangers and it's excellent reading with some really cool old-school testimonials, blurbs, etc. Good stuff.

That said, his words concerning Avery and Jagr as they walked out the door were not his finest moment and definitely deserving of the criticism others have leveled.

paulinflorida,

No I didn't expect Sean to say that he loved NY and missed it or any of that ... Jagr hasn't said that ... Jagr has been a classy man, saying that the team and him had different views on the contract length and thanked everyone for all they did for him ... As much as some think that Sather trashed Avery the Rangers and specially it's players and the coaching staff did A LOT for Sean Avery ... he wouldn't of gotten that contract from Dallas had he been toiling on the 3rd-4th line with the Kings as he had been before he was traded to NY and not only was given 2nd and even 1st line minutes but was always on the gossip pages, building his persona up ...

Again if he truly respected the team and his former teammates and the coaching staff then he wouldn't of taken those parting shots at players that were signed instead of him ... I wasn't surprised either, that's who he is, he makes noise to get attention, I get it .. but I don't think it's excusable ... he was a Ranger and while he was with us I could let it go, he's no longer here and so I call him for what he is .. a classless punk ...

I'm happy he's in Dallas, were he can be promptly ignored by 99% of the media who only care about the Cowboys year-round

Yes, Avery is not a politician, and yes Jagr walked out the door with a lot of class. But Stan Fischler, as p.r. mouthpiece for the Rangers, has been very obnoxious and disrespectful about both of these former successful Rangers, and it is embarassing to read his column, which is publicized on the Rangers website. Stan should be above that kind of writing at this point in his career, and more importantly, the Rangers management should be above ripping their former players as well. Detroit didn't criticize Shanahan when he left, but the Rangers have consistently badmouthed their former players, whether it's Bure, Lindros, Holik, Jagr or Avery. That's why Leetch didn't bother to mention Sather in his remarks at his retirement ceremony -- not an accidental slip. Rangers p.r. strategy is very insulting to the fans.

Your right Matty....the Rangers had a lot to do with turning Sean into a player that could command the salary he got. He took every advantage of the NY showcase (along with playing some good hockey at times)and cashed in on it. Just by saying a few things about the Rangers, even if it meant being disrespectful,it doesn't matter to him, this is what he gets paid to do.....it was on his job resume and he is just picking up where he left off last year.

I listened to both interviewes and i didnt hear him talk about Naslund and Redden.Wwas it in Press conferenrece or radio show?

I suspect Leetch didn't mention Sather in his remarks because Slats traded Brian on Brian's BD without so much as a hint of a head's up.

Sather wasn't a whole lot classier when he dumped Graves, either. Obviously, the double standard Slats had with Mess did not extend to these true blue Rangers.

Which is not to say the PR is not also insulting to fans. That's also true.

Bobbyc
Great post. Your 100% correct. Martys been like a spoiled kid for years. Took the words right out of my mouth.

Paulf

That "unwritten code" seems to work when players want it to.

At least 3 of Avery's new teammates questioned his signing based upon his past.

I do not have a problem with Avery questioning whether someone can handle playing in NYC because we are doing it ourselves.

Matty

Saying that guys like Naslund and Redden might not be able to handle playing in NYC is not trashing them, it is an opinion.

The Ranger's history is littered with those who came to the Rangers with great resumes only to fail to handle the pressure of playing in NYC.

Avery handled it even if people did not like his antics so I think he just might have a good idea about this subject.

You can even make a claim that Avery was jealous that the Rangers used the money they spent on Redden, Naslund and Rosy instead of him.

Time will tell if Avery is right but sorry you are missing the point as everyone here knows that I am the last person to defend Avery but I will here.

If anyone thinks even for a second that what the Maven wrote about both Jagr and Avery on a MSG controlled website did not have the approval of either management or ownership then sorry there is a bridge in Jackson Heights I would like to sell you.

Yes Avery is the enemy now and when he comes to NYC I expect a circus. I expect him to yap his heart out and the media will have a field day with the Sean Avery show.

Yes Avery was the master of self promotion as I was saying that for the last year plus.

Avery was a lot of things but when he was a Ranger there was one thing he never was and that was a locker room cancer.

That the Rangers were saying that before free agency had even started was wrong and as KC pointed out something that the Rangers have done to others.

Cutter

Greetings but last person here has to purchase a round of iced tea for the house.

Gravey

That is part of what bothers me as yes hockey is a business but when you have people who have gone above and beyond for you then they deserve better.

KC

Well said

As much as I may have liked him, enough already. The stars will be begging the rangers to accept him in trade and eating part of his salary in the process. Figure two years.

Well rangers signed lots of 3rd and 4th liners. Based on the preseason schedule maybe the rangers needed cheap veteran talent that could be good gap fillers. Maybe there will be an in flux of young promising hartford types. Maybe the 3rd and 4th liners will be waived or sent to hartford when it is all said and done. Someone said it here or somewhere else, I would much rather see parenteau and korpikoski than rissmiller and voros. At least the two youngs guys could surprise and score some goals. Lots of players for split squad minimums. Just a thought.

Avery took advantage of his situation. And the old saying is "the devil that you know is better than the devil you don't know". Sean will have regret about leaving NY and the rangers will regret trying to trade him in for voros.

Sean craves attention. Too bad all that stuff about being a Ranger was BS. I will not miss him.

- jess - since you seem to be the blog moderator and conscious of bb+, please answer this: if (in addition to bb+) the non-password bb will have regular updates and remain open for business but without postings?? i missed that briefing. thanks.

as for avery, he brought a passion to the rangers the moment he took his first shift. that's what i'll remember. it was needed, especially with under the jagr/renney cool, calm and collected leadership. still, avery says some things that reveal his acceptance of his role as an instigator (and buffoon).

*digs out wallet*

All right! Iced tea is on me, folks! Drink up! :)

paulinflorida & Jess

I 100% get it ... I am not missing the point here ... I completely understand what he said and why he said it ... Yeah we are criticizing or questioning some moves but we care about how our team does and wish them the best do we not? Avery didn't say that in a constructive criticism sort of way, he came off like a jealous ex who had to get in a few parting shots before moving on to his new relationship ...

All I am trying to get accross is that Sean Avery is no longer a NY Ranger so I am done just going "That's Avery being Avery" or giving him a pass on anything he says and does ... that's all I am saying ... if you(Jess) want to go ahead and say that he has a right to say whatever he wants because the Rangers higher ups fired the first shot then that's fine ... I do not agree with it because he is talking about the team as a whole not about the individual people whom he feels dissed him ... I didn't like him before he got to NY, but I 100% appreciated what he did for us on the nights he was a presense on the ice, which wasn't always ... Now he's gone and I am back to seeing him for what he has always been ... He gets no sympathy or benefit of the doubt from me

Joeymole

Sorry I do not have the answers to your questions as this is the Dubi show and I have no role other than posting here.

When I post here it is my own views not the views of the magazine as that right also belongs to Dubi.

What I am seeing is that Dubi is using the non-password part of the site to tell folks what is going on. He has been saving his good stuff you folks here.

What else Dubi has in mind is unknown to me but I am sure Dubi when he sees your questions (as well as Denver Franks) will respond to them.

If not you can email him at blueshirt@mindspring.com

Matty

I did not like Avery either, I did not like his antics last year during the arbitration hearings or a lot of his comments.

But sorry the Rangers were so quick to trash Avery before he was out the door that yes going first to me is a major factor

Like Avery and his show or not the reality is while as a Ranger, Avery did his job and did it well.
$
On the other hand what the Rangers did to me smells of hypocrisy as we see the pretty shows the Rangers put on when they retire the numbers but as KC (sorry but you made the point better than I did KC) said their PR is insulting to the fans.

Avery you are right is now the enemy but I will bet top dollar that if the Rangers are struggling when the Stars do visit then watch Ranger fans treat Avery as a returning hero.

Anyone else

Look as the last person who will call himself an Avery fan, here is a couple of things to remember when people say Avery will wear out his welcome with the Stars.

(A) Yes Avery wore out his welcome in Los Angeles but we are still waiting for some kind of proof that he did the same thing as a Ranger. I never saw it nor has anyone I know on the Rangers said privately anything bad about him.

(B) Given a choice of who to like Avery or Marty Brodeur then give me Avery any day. Give me Avery over a guy who cheated on his wife with his own sister in law, who has repeatedly disrespected Henrik over some minor slight and who showed how low class he was by not shaking hands in hockey tradition.


I'd rather have Sean for 4 mill then Rozy for 5 mill, any day

Nobody's come out in public and said they didn't like Avery or that he was a "locker room cancer" but a fair number of people with inside sources (and I'm not talking about Stan, etc) have stated that many players in the room not only didn't like Avery but hated him. none of that trashes what he did on the ice for the team. But honestly if everyone loved the guy in the locker room there's no way they would have let him go. Very clearly they didn't want him back, and it seems unlikely that's based on his performance.

The plan from the start was to maintain BB.com as the front page with the day to day news on the Rangers from the world at large, moving only our own exclusively-generated content to BB+ for subscribers only. Also part of the plan from the start was to move the discussion to BB+ for subscribers only as a way to clear the space of trolls.

pghas -- I've read speculation that Avery must have ticked off some teammates for Sather to have lost interest in him, but I don't recall hearing specifically of any player saying so in public. We know that Jagr loved him both on and off the ice, we know that he and Shanahan hung out together off the ice, and we know that none of the young guys or depth players would take on a veteran who was tight with the top two players. So that leaves Gomez and Drury, who had reason to dislike Avery from their days with their former teams -- but we know that everyone hated Avery when he was a rival, so it's possible that they grew to appreciate him too as a teammate.

And even if some people didn't like him, so what? If he helped the team win, his locker room popularity would not be an issue -- and he did help the team win. And Zherdev was brought in despite being an unpopular teammate in Columbus. If the decision was based on any dislike, it must be Sather's dislike for Avery based on his negotiating stance and his disrespect for the "game of hockey" -- that too should not matter if he helps you win, but I think Sather was deeply embarrassed by some of his shenanigans.

Bottom line: I don't think anyone was worried about Avery in the first year or two of his contract, but they must not have thought he'd be anything other than a "detriment" (to use a Sather word) beyond that, and didn't want to be saddled with him for the addition 2-3 seasons past his expiration date.

DUBI did Sather offer Avery $3mil for 4 years or not? Even though it means little now, the real facts would be nice if there's a way to get them.

Andeas Jamtin was added to the rangers roster on the website. However no Nigel Dawes. There has to be a trade on the horizon.

roc

[Andeas Jamtin was added to the rangers roster on the website. However no Nigel Dawes. There has to be a trade on the horizon.]

I'm sure there is a trade coming before either training camp or before the season starts. But Dawes not being on the current NHL roster may have nothing to do with it. My thinking now is that the Rangers plan is to start Dawes in Hartford, even though he'll be in training camp. The Hartford 08-09 roster isn't up yet, but I bet that's where you'll see Dawes' name.

LisaMY

I sure hope you're wrong. If Nigel starts in Hartford, then we should trade him now. He EARNED a starting spot with his play last year. If a young player earns a spot, then gets sent back to the AHL it will poison our entire youth movement. It will prove that Baranka was right and it will spell the end of any young player thinking he may have a chance to make the big club. Not only that, but Dawes showed everybody that he could score in this league. On a team that will be looking for scoring, the loss of Dawes for anybody NOT AS GOOD AS Dawes will send a very bad message.

Let me add one more thing. The knock on Dawes was he didn't play a soild defensive game. That's why he didn't stay with the team two seasons ago. Well, he lead the Rangers in +/- with a +11. So he heard the message and made adjustments while producing 14G & 15A for 29 points. So the coaches want to reward that kind of turnaround by sending him to the minors? I'm not sure on this one, so would he have to pass thru waivers to get recalled? If so, then we can't send him back.

Avery you are right is now the enemy but I will bet top dollar that if the Rangers are struggling when the Stars do visit then watch Ranger fans treat Avery as a returning hero.

Ranger fans on MSG are quick to boo the team even when they are comming off a 10 game winning streak so what are you talking about Jess????

Whether we are winning or losing I can see fans embarrassing themselves and cheering him on as he does his act against our team ... so it isn't anything surprising to me if it does happen ... I hope it doesn't but I am expecting it ...

You and I will agree to disagree about Avery now ... right or wrong he is gone and he is back to being the little scumbag he has always been and I have no respect for him whatsoever ... I tolerated him and cheered him on when he was on our team ... Avery might be worth the money he is getting paid for a 1 or 2 yr deal but not for a 4 yr deal with a limited no-movement clause but only time will tell ...

He is gone and I have no loyalty for him and whatever he gets, he deserves ... that's how I feel about him and have always felt about him ... I don't care if the Rangers were mean and trashed him to certain media people who would take off with a story about it specially after the way he behaved last summer and used Larry Brooks in the same way you say Sather and/or whomever in the Ranger brass used Stan to deliver their shots ... so Avery started it last summer and the Rangers finished it this summer ... I don't really feel bad for him one way or another ...

He'll come and the Garden might embarrass itself and the city if they dare give him 1/10th of the ovation given for Leetch when he returned playing for the Bruins or Messier playing for the Canucks .. in fact before they went off the air the NHL Live's guys were joking and making fun of Rangers fans(who were calling and emailing non-stop about how the Rangers world just went into the toilet because Avery wasn't re-signed) and they joked "You think the ovation will be louder than Leetch's? Perhaps they should pass out tissues to all of them, make it "Welcome Back Sean, we MISS you" night ..." on and on they joked because of this persona this guy has and because of how overrated he is as far as being the supposed reason the Rangers had success or failure ... I just roll my eyes at all that crap

If the Rangers start Dawes in Hartford, they deserve all the heartache they're going to get when he emerges as a top player for a divisional rival very soon after end of next Rangers' contract. He'll be the latest in along line of star forwards we've shipped out early in their Ranger careers!

I don't think we should read too much into Dawes not being listed on the official site's roster. Too premature. Let's wait until training camp.

Matty

[right or wrong he is gone and he is back to being the little scumbag he has always been]

Yes we agree to disagree on this but I am sorry Matty what you wrote here bothers me.

Avery has done nothing at all that suggests he is back to being "xxxxbag" that you are calling him.

Please cite one instance that Avery has done that makes him what you called him.

If you want to call him that for signing elsewhere then hope you also call Sather that for how he has handled Jagr, Avery and even Shanny now.

I know what Avery has done and nothing he has said about the Rangers is even close to the Avery show of days past.

Call him the enemy yes but wait until he does in fact do something wrong before doing what you did here.

Just because some fans went on talk radio does not mean they are representative of the Ranger fans as a whole either.

Pghas

I have access to several players as well and none of those I talk to hated Avery. Avery to several of them actually was liked because he took heat off the team when he did some of his antics.

A few of them have been very (and I mean very) candid about their teammates privately to me but Avery was not one they hated.

JESS you have done a commendable job standing up for Avery. There is little reason for fans to be acting like he broke their hearts. He'll be welcomed back to the ice in NYC, then just be on the other team with Henrik's brother. Seems like most forgot the 'detriment' arbitration case, and the 'it's a business ' talk. I wish him good luck, he did little wrong to the NYR & their fans. Hopefully they meet in the finals.

Being a Ranger fan for a long time and my 'gut' tell me that NY fans will warmly welcome back Sean to the Garden...not 100% of the fans will..but a majority will cheer him...at least initially. He was a fan favorite and most Ranger fans are sophisicated enough to understand the business side of the game and sometimes fan favorites land up moving on...it's happened before and will happen again. Just think about how many times an ex-Ranger that you liked as a player takes the ice as the opposition and you can't help but remember his days as a Ranger. There are exceptions of course and Ranger fans have good memories....they don't forget anything. Now, if Sean does something out of control against the Rangers or injures a player, then the tide turns and those cheers will be gone forever.

Hi all.
I’m not Avery fan. But what was bothering me for about a season and a half is our well-known record with him and without. Stunning difference. I kept thinking, what kind of team needs Avery yapping to have that spark to keep going? What kind of season we’d have if he wasn’t a Ranger? But I’m kinda glad he is gone. It was too much non-hockey BS going on around him. Looking forward to a new team, new season. Team that will not need Avery to win.

Avery has done nothing at all that suggests he is back to being "xxxxbag" that you are calling him.

I called him that because that's my opinion of him ... I think the guy is dirt and have always thought so ... when he was on our team I let it go because he was on our team ... i do not like him and never have ... he is just an attention seeking [insert whatever word you want here] and that's that to me ... He's no longer on our team so I no longer have to hold back my feelings on the guy ... it's that plain and simple

Dawes added to the Rangers Roster. I guess they read this site. LOL

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